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Weekly Topic/Class/Discussion Notes - Sunday, September 4, 2011

Sunday, September 4, 2011

Collars - Types and Purposes

 

Class log  09-04-2011

[CJsHere] 9:01 pm: looks like a small group today, everyone taking advantage of the last weekend of summer..
[CJsHere] 9:03 pm: looks to My watch,, I'll give this about 2 minutes,, and we'll get started.
[CJsHere] 9:05 pm: okay, looks to be about that time,, so,, without further delay, let's get this show on the road, shall we?
[CJsHere] 9:06 pm: Wednesday evening, at skye's suggestion, we talked a bit about "negotiating a new relationship"..
[CJsHere] 9:06 pm: seems there was also a suggestion of talking about clarifying what a collar means.
[CJsHere] 9:07 pm: but, we didn't get to that one, so, for tonight,, guess we'll talk about collars.. (and perhaps if time permits, leashes as well... )
[CJsHere] 9:08 pm: but,, collars.. hmm,, where to start.. first,, let's realize there are two different categories of collars within the lifestyle,, the first, is the D/s or M/s collar, the second is the BDSM or Kink collar.
[CJsHere] 9:09 pm: let's first touch on the BDSM/Kink collar, since that's probably the easiest to explain and understand,,
[CJsHere] 9:09 pm: that one is simple.. essentially, the BDSM/Kink collar has NO meaning at all.. it for decoration, for show,, a play toy,, it has no repeat absolutely NO meaning towards commitment,
[CJsHere] 9:10 pm: that's a collar that you might wear to a play party,, it might even be one you'd see someone walking down the street, all dressed up in their goth best, wearing a collar..
[CJsHere] 9:11 pm: it's worn to facilitate play, or a scene,, or in essence for anything you want to wear it for,,, make sense?
[Rod] 9:11 pm: yuppers
[twinkle] 9:11 pm: yes Sir CJ
[stargazer] 9:12 pm: yes Sir
[brandy] 9:12 pm: yesSir
[jane_DB] 9:12 pm: yes Sir
[kraziek] 9:12 pm: yes Sir
[rowan-oak] 9:12 pm: yes Sir

[CJsHere] 9:12 pm: okay, now let's move on to the D/s, or M/s (Dominant/submissive or Master/slave collar)... yep, this ones going to take a bit more explaining and a bit more understanding,,
[CJsHere] 9:13 pm: first,, let's confuse everyone .. under the guise of D/s or M/s collars, there are actually several different kinds or types (categories, levels, etc) of collars..
[CJsHere] 9:14 pm: some are widely recognized throughout the lifestyle, whether online, real life or anything else,, others,, aren't really recognized in real life and are more looked at as an online game type collar..
[jane_DB] 9:15 pm: such as protection, training, permanent, Sir?
[CJsHere] 9:16 pm: first on the list to talk about,, the "Protection Collar".. you'll have to pardon, as many, especially those from the "old school" way of the lifestyle will chuckle a bit about that one,, and I'll try to explain,
[CJsHere] 9:17 pm: the Protection Collar, as far as I can determine after having done a bunch of digging on the subject and having talked with many people, seems to be a carry over from the BDSM side of things,,
[CJsHere] 9:18 pm: while it wasn't really a collar, a Top might for example bring a bottom to a BDSM event or play party, perhaps just to visit, look around, get an idea of what it was all about.. It was generally (and still is) considered that the Top was responsible for the bottom while she/he was at the event to make sure no one bothered them, or scared them off.. ie., intimidated them,, hence the term, "protection",, they were deemed to be under that Top's protection for their visit.
[CJsHere] 9:19 pm: protection for their visit to the function,, others were expected to leave them alone, not to bother them while they took their "tour"..
[Rod] 9:19 pm: tourists...
[CJsHere] 9:20 pm: in no way did or does this collar represent ownership.. or responsibility beyond the immediate presence or circumstances,, essentially, think of it as a guest pass.. and a tour guide...
[CJsHere] 9:21 pm: Oh yes, now along comes the internet and all the multiple fantasy playrooms and wannabe Dom's and idiots (read that trolls)..
[Rod] 9:21 pm: tourists are the future...do not tamper with them
[CJsHere] 9:22 pm: to many in this latter category, the quickest way to earmark a sub/slave for collaring or exclusive use in in the name of a "protection collar".... hey, I'm protecting that girl. don't talk to her, don't say anything to her without My permission,,, essentially a "keep off" sign,
[CJsHere] 9:23 pm: and first thing you know, essentially that protection collar, supposedly designed to protect a sub/slave from all the idiots has suddenly become nothing more than an intimidation to restrict her to one specific idiot.
[CJsHere] 9:24 pm: now, in all fairness,, yes, I am sure there are some of those floating around online that may have a very valid, on the up and up purpose so to speak,, I'm sure, somewhere there are sub/slaves actually being protected by the use of a protection collar,, but,,
[CJsHere] 9:24 pm: there are two separate and distinct trains of thought on that,, and I'll try to clarify,,
[CJsHere] 9:25 pm: first,, yes, I am certain, there are sub/slaves out there that really need to be protected,,, but not necessarily from "others", but rather from themselves,,, hmm, better think about that one a bit,
[CJsHere] 9:26 pm: oh, we've all see the type,, too eager, too anxious.. too horney,, too what ever,, yes, that kind of sub/slave needs to be reined in and protected.. but again, IMHO, not from anyone else, except themselves,, so yes, a protection collar of some sort would probably be good for them,,
[jane_DB] 9:26 pm: Sir, i have a question
[CJsHere] 9:27 pm: and to the other line of thought,, hmmm,,, a protection collar, in the online world,, someone better explain to someone, what is it that they are protecting a sub/slave from?
[CJsHere] 9:27 pm: yes jane, listens,, while I continue to type..
[jane_DB] 9:27 pm: is part of this protection also some sort of training?
[CJsHere] 9:28 pm: are they protecting from a virus online? shouldn't the sub/slave have enough brains to say,, "sorry, no thank you,, ".. or better yet, if things get really out of line,, wouldn't they be better served to learn where the delete or block buttons are on the computer, or even better still, how to shut the damn computer off?
[CJsHere] 9:28 pm: no,, a protection collar is definitely not a "training collar".
[CJsHere] 9:29 pm: again, look back up to where I first started talking about a protection collar,, what it's purpose is/was..
[CJsHere] 9:30 pm: again, I'm sure there are those that will take issue with what I've said about a "protection collar", but, I'll stand on what I'm saying,,, and I think if you really look at it with an open mind, you'll have to agree, at least with a good portion of what I've said,,
[CJsHere] 9:30 pm: especially after we finish talking about other types of collars.
[CJsHere] 9:31 pm: Again, remember,, the D/s and M/s Lifestyle is really based about ongoing commitments and lasting relationships. It's based on commitment, involvement, trust,
[CJsHere] 9:32 pm: now, if we consider a "protection collar".. what if anything does that do to express those things, such as commitment? what does it do to foster responsibility? or acceptance of each other?
[CJsHere] 9:32 pm: make sense? and yes, listens for and invites comments and questions, pauses,,
[fire_AsjFG] 9:33 pm: i wouldn't think it is a two way street.. so to speak... is it?
[Rod] 9:33 pm: there are a couple of "protection" collars in use by some here on asj
[CJsHere] 9:33 pm: nope, very one sided.
[fire_AsjFG] 9:33 pm: it's just... One...looking out for another....
[Rod] 9:33 pm: the term may not be appropriate
[Rod] 9:34 pm: but the effect is to slow the girl down and protect her from herself
[CJsHere] 9:34 pm: and again, as with anything else in the lifestyle,, I would tell you to take what fits for your relationship and go from there,, who am I to say you are right or wrong, all I can do to you is point out, or express what I believe to be the "norms" within the lifestyle,, and yes, can try to point you to others to show why it will, or will not work,
[fire_AsjFG] 9:35 pm: i think it is ... from what i have seen here...to make the girl..accountable
[Rod] 9:35 pm: it has had that effect for sure fire
[CJsHere] 9:35 pm: from there,, you have to make it work for you,,, again remember,, these names are nothing more than words,, while one might call something a "protection collar", that's only a noun,, when in fact, they may have in their mind an entirely different definition.
[CJsHere] 9:37 pm: okay, not hearing any more comments,, next on the list,, the "training collar"..
[CJsHere] 9:38 pm: hmm,, interesting animal... it's been My experience that there are some that believe in it, some that don't... some feel a sub/slave should only be "trained" by the one that will ultimately own them, hence there should be no reason for a training collar,, you either take them, or you don't..
[CJsHere] 9:38 pm: and yes, personally, I accept and welcome the individuals right to that school of thought,, nothing wrong with it, "if" that is what works for them,
[CJsHere] 9:39 pm: you'll find the "training collar" is primarily an online vehicle.. and allow Me to explain,
[CJsHere] 9:41 pm: in the online world, it can be difficult to see who is kneeling next to someone so to speak,, so, the training collar becomes a way of saying,, please don't interfere,, I have a plan how I want this sub/slave trained,, so please, step aside,, if I want your assistance, I'll ask for it,, meantime, hands off.
[CJsHere] 9:41 pm: the training collar, like the protection collar, does not appear to offer a long term commitment,,, nor does it imply a continuing, long lasting relationship, in fact, quite the opposite.
[CJsHere] 9:43 pm: IMHO, there are many Dominants that just aren't up to (whatever the reason, and yes, there are some very valid reasons) teaching a girl about the lifestyle.. instilling within the girl the obedience and dedication that they really want within the girl,,
[CJsHere] 9:43 pm: or, maybe even a totally different focus,, perhaps they just don't feel qualified, or up to the task of teaching all or some of the BDSM aspects of the lifestyle,,,
[CJsHere] 9:44 pm: yes, "training a sub/slave" can be something very broad and all encompassing, or it can be very finite,,, working on only one or two items,, or issues.
[CJsHere] 9:45 pm: and yes, a Dominant can have a sub/slave and fully collared (we'll talk about full collars in a few moments) and still have someone else have a so called training collar on them,,,
[CJsHere] 9:46 pm: again, while you will occasionally here the term "training collar" in real life, more often than not, it is a term reserved for online relationships..
[CJsHere] 9:46 pm: Remember,, a sub/slave does not have to wear any type of collar, or be committed to any type of long lasting relationship to learn about the lifestyle
[CJsHere] 9:47 pm: (no,, we wont enter into the debate/discussion this evening of "training sub/slaves",,, yes, that can take more than a couple of hours to discuss whether a sub/slave even needs to be trained,,, we'll just accept that as a given for the moment, and move on from there.
[CJsHere] 9:48 pm: any questions or comments on a "training collar"?
[stargazer] 9:48 pm: no Sir
[fire_AsjFG] 9:48 pm: no Master
[sexylilmama89] 9:49 pm: no Sir
[kraziek] 9:49 pm: no Sir
[rowan-oak] 9:49 pm: no Sir
[CJsHere] 9:49 pm: okay, moving up the list,,, the "Collar of Consideration"...
[CJsHere] 9:50 pm: this is one, IMHO too many people forget about... oh, if more people would use this,, I think real collars wouldn't be abused as much as they are.. far fewer people would be hurt (emotionally, psychologically)..
[CJsHere] 9:50 pm: yes, this collar is commonly found in real life, just as it is online,,
[CJsHere] 9:51 pm: If you would,, compare this as the vanilla equivalent of an engagement ring,,
[CJsHere] 9:51 pm: oh world,, I think we've found each other,, ... but,,,,,, we're still gonna test the waters a bit to be sure,,
[CJsHere] 9:52 pm: sure, you start to "plan" (commit, discuss, consider) the future and all the long range plans you have ahead of you,, things you want to do and accomplish, goals you want to set and achieve,,
[CJsHere] 9:53 pm: but yet, in your mind, while yes, perhaps devastating if things don't work out,,, you've got it in the back of your mind that yes,, it's only an engagement,, so however "slight", there is a chance of calling it off.
[CJsHere] 9:54 pm: there is also the intermittent step that you don't give away the candy store, sign over all your assets,, commit to moving to the other side of the world, etc., etc.... it's a stepping stone,, a step you're talking, a little bit at a time to see if things are going to work out..
[CJsHere] 9:55 pm: yes,, it might even mean exclusivity (if you're monogamous),, yes, it means hey,, we're thinking about each other,, so please,, respect that, keep your distance while we try to make this work,
[CJsHere] 9:55 pm: yes, commitments, responsibilities are starting to fall into place, that ongoing obedience, responsibilities, etc are becoming established,, (hey, we're working on it, together!)
[CJsHere] 9:56 pm: the limits you move to, or past are those you mutually agree on,,, some might even call it a "trial period"..
[CJsHere] 9:58 pm: it's a way of working up to a full blown relationship.. how long does a Collar of Consideration last? how long does an engagement last,, that's up to those involved.. a day, a week, a year, a lifetime, who cares,, the only ones that should be worried about that are those in the relationship..
[CJsHere] 9:58 pm: questions, comments, thoughts? pauses and listens,
[fire_AsjFG] 9:58 pm: how is a collar of consideration... shown.. online... just like a regular collar?
[CJsHere] 10:00 pm: Not a lot of this is how its done so to speak, but for most that I have seen, it is usually with a small "c" following the collar,, ie; sub_DOMc
[fire_AsjFG] 10:01 pm: don't think i've ever seen one.. why i asked
[CJsHere] 10:01 pm: nods,, any other comments, questions?
[brandy] 10:02 pm: ...no yet Sir..
[sexylilmama89] 10:02 pm: no Sir
[CJsHere] 10:02 pm: now the drum roll.. the grand daddy of em all, the one that should mean the most to all of us,, the collar, full collar, collar of ownership, or whatever you refer to it as,,
[CJsHere] 10:03 pm: that's it,, signed, sealed and delivered! It's not meant to be a temporary thing, no, it isn't made with Velcro fasteners so to speak,, it's designed to last,, it's a symbol of "mutual commitment"..
[CJsHere] 10:04 pm: notice I said "mutual"... hmm, too many seem to think it's the sub/slave that wears the collar, so the commitments and responsibilities are one sided..
[CJsHere] 10:04 pm: remember,, a collar, regardless of the type of collar signifies a "mutual relationship or commitment"..
[CJsHere] 10:05 pm: Unfortunately, yes, there are some that for what ever reasons do end up parting,, collars come off,, but that shouldn't be the norm,, that isn't the intent of entering into a relationship for a full collar..
[CJsHere] 10:07 pm: IMHO that's part of what is wrong with society in general today,, too many vanilla marriages, people just give up,, divorce, it' the easy way out,, hell.. we'll get married, try it out, if it don't work,, divorce,, they're easy and cheap,, (some can be)... there is no consideration given to long term consequences,, hence the reason society now looks more and more towards D/s relationships as being accepted and viable..
[CJsHere] 10:08 pm: and yes, I believe that acceptance and viability will continue to be recognized more and more as more people find out that D/s relationships do work, and do last..
[CJsHere] 10:09 pm: as to the specifics of the relationship,, that's up to those in the relationship,, no, you can't say, okay, I'm collared now, so I have to say Sir, or kneel, or get my tush beat,,, again, those are all part of the big picture, what you've "negotiated" your relationship to be..
[CJsHere] 10:10 pm: when you suddenly accept that collar,, should things change? in My opinion, probably not much at all.. because if you've gone about developing your relationship properly, all the things put into place by the collar have actually started to happen, one step at a time all thru the "courting" process..
[CJsHere] 10:12 pm: you've developed your communication,, trust, respect, honesty, sure, maybe the acceptance of the full collar means now you'll physically move in 24/7, etc. etc. but, along the way to developing that final commitment, I would think most of what is planned to happen when you finally get that collar has started to happen already,, hope that makes sense, I don't think I'm saying it to clearly.
[jane_DB] 10:13 pm: it does Sir
[CJsHere] 10:13 pm: okay, questions, comments about a "full collar"..
[fire_AsjFG] 10:13 pm: lol... no Master...
[brandy] 10:13 pm: no Sir...
[CJsHere] 10:14 pm: next collar on the list,, the room/home/enclave/family collar..
[CJsHere] 10:15 pm: Hmm, this one can have a lot of variance in it's meaning, and essentially, the room/home/enclave/family establishing the collar will define exactly what it means or what it entails..
[CJsHere] 10:15 pm: often this type of a collar is a combination of all the collars we've talked about..
[CJsHere] 10:15 pm: there can be many reasons for this type of collar, and yes, you'll find them in real life as well as in the online world.
[CJsHere] 10:16 pm: yes, this type of collar will normally signify at least to some extent, control and commitment.. but again, remember, that commitment is to both the one wearing the collar, and the one giving the collar.
[CJsHere] 10:18 pm: I've been asked about "Mentors Collars",, and to that I have to chuckle.. a Mentor, giving a collar? Get real... consider what a Mentor is,, and then ask yourself why would a Mentor offer a collar? or better still,, what purpose could it possibly serve,, no, no Mentors Collar,, you want that, go get a friendship ring,
[CJsHere] 10:19 pm: Yes,, as you wander around the lifestyle, you may find other names for collars,, but look / ask what there purpose is,, what is it they define? why are they used... I think you'll find that those collars will generally fall into one of the categories listed above..
[CJsHere] 10:20 pm: Remember, it doesn't really matter what you call a collar.. nor does it matter what the collar looks like, or when it's worn,,, what does matter is your understanding of what the collar is all about, and why it's being worn,,
[CJsHere] 10:21 pm: Does a sub/slave physically have to wear a "collar" to be collared,, nope,, a collar can in fact be nothing more that a mutually spoken agreement and a "mutual ACCEPTANCE" of that agreement.
[CJsHere] 10:21 pm: the important thing to remember about a collar,, the collar indicates or specifies an ongoing commitment,,
[CJsHere] 10:22 pm: it indicates a mutually agreed upon relationship within the boundaries that all concerned have agreed to.. nothing more, nothing less..
[CJsHere] 10:23 pm: okay, I know there are at least 103 questions,, and some comments, so let's hear some of them,, listens,
[stargazer] 10:24 pm: why is it that so few understand the meaning of collars and give them so freely without any meaning or so it appears
[CJsHere] 10:24 pm: smiles,, a good question star,, and one, I'm sorry, I don't have an answer for..
[Rod] 10:25 pm: simple lack of open communication...
[stargazer] 10:25 pm: thank You Sir...
[CJsHere] 10:25 pm: I think it is because too many don't take the time to understand what a D/s relationship is really all about, they don't understand or accept the commitment that needs to be in a D/s relationship..
[stargazer] 10:25 pm: very sad
[CJsHere] 10:25 pm: and yes, for many, regretfully, to them, it's nothing more than a game,,
[Rod] 10:25 pm: and a lack of honesty between two people
[CJsHere] 10:26 pm: nods in agreement with Rod..
[CJsHere] 10:26 pm: and yes, one other thing to consider,
[stargazer] 10:26 pm: thank You
[brandy] 10:26 pm: Sir, i have read where a collar can be a special necklace, or even an "eternity collar" purchased on their website..
[CJsHere] 10:27 pm: the advent of the internet has really helped to get the word out that D/s relationships do exist and they do work,, but, at the same time, the downside,, it's brought lots of players out of the woodwork, yes, regretfully, Dom and sub/slave.. those players aren't helping things,
[CJsHere] 10:27 pm: a collar can be essentially anything,, words, a piece of string, a golden chain, a steel band,, a cigarette lighter,, a hair ribbon, a brand,,
[Rod] 10:28 pm: a collar can also be an understanding, not requiring anything tangiable more than the understanding itself if the communication and honesty is present
[CJsHere] 10:28 pm: nods in full agreement with Rod.
[CJsHere] 10:29 pm: any other questions or comments about collars? what they represent, or why they are there?
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